Noob fly line setup

[Bunnyfoofoo 49]

how do you do it?

i know backer line.. then float line... then leader or tippet or small leader of 30 lbs mono then tippet with perfection loop. ahahahah

and with what leader material should i use and what tippet.

gonna try for steelies keep that in mind

[Snowball 75]

Bunnyfoofoo:

This site may help you out:

http://www.flyfishingfromscratch.com/blog/

Regards,

Snowball

[Guest Wes]

Hey...

I think it is a bit more complex than just "how do you do it?"

If you are planning to fish for steelhead using fly gear there are a number of approaches that each require DIFFERENT setups...

Since you mentioned you will be using a floating line... then I imagine you will NOT be swinging flies with sink tips...so I will comment on floating line setups.

Floating lines are very useful for using "upstream" or "nymphing" strategies. If you plan on doing that, then you will require a more specialized leader than the standard factory tapers sold in stores.

Factory leaders have a long thick "butt" section which aids in turning over wind resistant flies and "straightening" the presentation out at the end of the cast. However that is NOT what you want to be doing when you are using upstream dead drifting techniques. The long thick butt section will inhibit your ability to get the fly drifting deep as it has a large cross section and surface area which slows its sink rate. Furthermore it gets pulled UP to the surface by the current when the water exhibits force on it....exactly what you DON'T want. This is ONE of the reasons many people new to this technique feel the need to keep adding more and more, and even more weight to get the fly down. Eventually they have so much weight on the end that:

i) they can no longer flycast the rig! ( so much for the joy of fly casting!)

ii) they are dragging and bouncing the bottom on a tight line... (so much for upstream dead drfting!)

iii) The fly is no longer drifting naturally. ( so much for being really effective)

There are a variety of leader designs (Some quite complex) that are much more effective than factory leaders for this technique, but the SIMPLEST is as follows. Build a leader that tapers VERY quickly down from 30 lb to 12 lb in about 2 or maybe 2 1/2 ft. Add a long section of 10 lb to complete the leader. You want a very short butt section and a long thin main section. Build several of these in a variety of lengths or make them all about 7 ft and lengthen them as you need on the river. Generally the leaders will run from 7 to 12 ft. Your tippet will be added to the end of the leader, and will vary from 12"- 30" (depending on the situation) and will have a breaking strength of LESS than the leader ( 8 or 6 lb).

Use a Perfection loop or a double surgeons loop at the thick end of the leader so you can loop it to your fly line. Build your leader with bloods and add your tippet with a double surgeons knot. You can't go wrong with Maxima.

The idea is that the long thin diameter main section of the leader will cut easily through the water and get deep quickly with MINIMAL addition of weight. This will occur very easily if the cast is NOT straightened out on delivery, but instead "tucked" under and "piled" up at the end of the cast. The fly can then tumble down deep very quickly, without having to PULL or DRAG down a big fat leader. It will stay down there too, fishing nicely, as some big fat leader isn't being pulled UP by the current, and pulling up the on fly! Of course a certain amount of line control and skill will be required to KEEP the fly doing it's thing. The key to this technique REALLY working wonders, is LESS weight (not more weight), with lots and lots of line control.

This leader design will NOT work well for most other fly fishing situations. For all those other situations factory leaders are just fine....

That right there you can take to the bank. About as good of advice as you find anywhere. I've filed it away for that rare occasion when I'll reach for the fly rod over the float rod.

[Bunnyfoofoo 49]

great post had to read it 3 times ..thank you very much i also was wondering about maxima and you answered it great.. again thanks

[brookiebuster 117]

Great post Duck. All I do for my steelie leaders is add about 8" of 20lb mono nail knotted to the end of the fly line with a perfection loop on the other end. Then I add 6-12ft of 8-10lb fluorocarbon (depending on the conditions of whatever river I'm fishing) to the end of the 20lb mono with a perfection loop. I then attach my egg or nympth to the end and add a few bb sized splitshot about 8-12" above the fly. Caught quite a few so haven't changed my technique. Of course you have to alter everything depending on the conditions of the river. It may not be the best way but its simple and it works for me. Good luck.

[AB 98]

A couple of other things to add on that leader design, and the fishing technique to use it effectively.

1) the belly length of the leader should be about 3X the depth of the water you are fishing. Keep adjusting it according to the water. To short and you pile everything under water and get drag. To long and it winds up out of control doing a snake dance and snagging up.

2) Try and keep the heavier part off the butt section out of the water - hence the name High Stick nymphing. Get your rod tip up, and have the line in your other hand. Setting the hook is a two hand job. One lifts the rod a little higher while the other pulls in line to tighten everything up and drive the hook home.

3) Use a tiny amount of Bio-Strike to stain 2 or three of the knots in the butt. If you only have a little - put it on the knot where the belly of the leader (long thin section) is tied to the butt. This gives you a visual indication of things going on above and below the surface. If you have to, wool indicators are okay. Anything else is a bobber....

4) Watch the leader like your life depended on it. You won't feel a trout pick up the fly very often, but you will see the leader do something it hasn't done in previous drifts. A slight dart or stall is often all you get. When in doubt - set the hook.

Consider learning to tie a Bimini Twist to connect the belly to the butt of the leader - it acts as a shock absorber and can save your bacon during the fight.

good luck,

iceman

[Guest Wes]

Consider learning to tie a Bimini Twist to connect the belly to the butt of the leader - it acts as a shock absorber and can save your bacon during the fight.

Why don't you tell him to learn quantum physics because that would be easier.

All kidding aside. If I ever figure out what I am doing wrong, I would also use the bimini.

Wes

[Guest scavs]

If properly rigged any normal size indicator shouldn't be floating your offering, I have heard this expression before but I'm not sure I understand how that applies. As I understand indicators are strictly a visual aid and yes I'm sure the larger ones catch some water. If you could shed some light on this that would be awesome.

[Guest scavs]

Thank you I didn't realize people literally floated flies under bobbers over cover. The indicators I use are 3/4 of an inch long and not very buoyant at all and I find them fine for casting and mending

I feel I owe a little bit of my success to indicators

[AB 98]

Why don't you tell him to learn quantum physics because that would be easier.

All kidding aside. If I ever figure out what I am doing wrong, I would also use the bimini.

Wes

Wes,

Bimini's aren't just for fly fishing.

Its a great way to join lines and leaders where there is a difference in line hardness and diameter. You can get away with a really high diameter differential thanks to the loop connection and shock absorbtion properties of the knot when you tie it in the softer line.

Its useful for downrigging salmon when you are fishing deep and have to sink the line right to the back of the release to get it away from false releases. When running flashers, I always have a bimini between the flasher and the fly or hoochie, doesn't let the fish have as strong a lever with the flasher.

Its an extremely usefull knot, and a lot less complicated to tie than you think.

iceman

[Snowball 75]

Bimini Twist

>http://youtu.be/Bl5OlzKMcYA

Regards,

Snowball

[flybum 95]

I use a double Bimini to attach my fly line to my backing. A single is quite simple and rigs can be made to make them even more simple. I've seen(but never used) people take red mono and wrap it multiple times on a pencil and dunk them in hot water. They use them inline as an indicator, I believe. Very neat.

[flybum 95]

Like so...

[Guest Wes]

Iceman,

I know most of the benefits of the bimini and I wasn't doubting you at all. I have also you-tubed it several times but I always bugger up the back twist. Mine always looks like a bloody yard sale when it's done. I revert back to the albright or nail-knot. Those I can do. I'll figure it out eventually.

[Guest scavs]

My apologies should of mentioned the expression was "anything else is a bobber" that needed light shedding but I think you got that. Thanks again

[Guest scavs]

Duck if you have time I would actually like to know your thoughts on leader formulas and sink tip choices for swinging wet flies in both high and low water conditions

Thanks

[AB 98]

Iceman,

I know most of the benefits of the bimini and I wasn't doubting you at all. I have also you-tubed it several times but I always bugger up the back twist. Mine always looks like a bloody yard sale when it's done. I revert back to the albright or nail-knot. Those I can do. I'll figure it out eventually.

like in the video - the secret to the back twist is a clean , properly fitting sports sock!

I've damn near ripped a toe nail off a couple times putting in the back twist bare foot!

[Guest scavs]

One-handed please & thank you

[Guest scavs]

This absolutely helps thankyou